I always knew that
Life was twisted for me
As the older that I grew
I also grew more carefree
And I’d always learn less
From the more that I’d see
For what made sense back then
Is now a mystery
And now everything logical
Lies in the minds tranquility,
In being liberated from the world
And in just living free
Wednesday, August 18, 2010
Sunday, May 9, 2010
Capital Punishment - A debate.
Here's a debate that began with one persons opinions in a note on facebook, and went on to being a full fledged discussion about everything that would make for my take on capital punishment.
Boris :
1. Man seriously, get a grip, how on earth does this scare any terrorist anywhere in the world, i mean come on, there are more suicide bombers produced everyday and it will go on forever, this way the guy is gna be all patriot like in his little screwed up terrorist group.
2. Killing kasab is like doing him the biggest favour ever, well if a lot of url dont know, to die is one of the things that makes these jackasses immortal fr their peers, i mean getting killed after killing 166 people, he is now legend, so basically we, our judicial system is contributing and actually encouraging this even more
3. I believe that the people who died had some family, for those families life is hell now cuz they live forever with the loss of their loved one and the punishment to dis guy is actually not a punishment, infact it is such a breeze, no suffering and just die.. The affected people are going to go through way more emotional and psychological trauma and some will live dead inside.. how is that fair to any of those people
4. I agree that a lot of money was spent on keeping him alive, why do that, give him like a 60 years of imprisonment and give him the worst life ever, let him regret what he did every second of his life.
5. The very idea of killing one person or killing 200 people, it is still killing someone else, then why does he get death sentence and a guy with 2 murders proven get 20 years of trauma, why no give him capital punishment and let him go.
6. the fact that the judicial system exists is to see to it that nobody kills nobody and that no human being has the power and right to take the life of another human being then how does it give the judicial system the right to kill a person, who kills the judicial system?
7. I am not saying that kasab is a good guy, in fact I would torture him to extents he would cry tears of blood, but there is a lot we don’t know abt these people and how they actually become what they are, there is a huge amount of torture and repeated black mail and religious black mail that goes on that make certain people completely control these freaks, so I really don’t think killing them is fair, but they should be punished, if he decides to kill himself that is his decision not our decision.
8. considering the fact that there are a lot of our leaders, I will not name, who have caused the death of a lot more people, where are they ? in their beautiful houses and the fast cars and chartered helicopters I guess, lets get real and actually know before we make rampant arguments.
Garima :
To add more to the discussion, I just remember how many of the people pretending to be shocked and outraged by the actions of kasab and co on 26/11 have often given a very "simplistic" solution to the Indo-Pak problem. "Just bomb/nuke the whole bloody country and terrorism will be over once and for all" "India is too soft" they say. How is ... See ... See moremorebombing/nuking an entire country full of innocent, uninvolved people for the crimes of a few thousand "terrorists" any less sinister in its intention than what the terrorists are doing in India. Since they believe India is the cause of their problems, just like we think pak is of ours, it is ridiculous to be assuming a higher moral ground. Violence to end violence is like f****ing for virginity.
"the mood and temper of the public in regard to the treatment of crime and criminals is one of the most unfailing tests of the civilization of any country. a calm and dispassionate recognition of the rights... See more….even of the convicted criminal against the state,... [and] tireless [efforts] towards the discovery of curative and regenerative processes,… mark and measure the stored up strength of a nation, and are the sign and proof of the living virtue in it" - winston churchill
Abhik Basu :
while i completely agree with the point that killing them helps them achieve the very immortality they wish to seek, i feel like the judiciary has its hands tied. we are having this argument after he has been given capital punishment, but think for a moment if he wasnt. there would be a HUGE uproar in the ranks for its the rational beings in this ... See morecountry that are the real minority.
my views on capital punishment are different altogether, but i feel like no one feel better or worse if and when he is executed. an execution is a mere treatment of the symptom, not the cause.
the truth is this argument is more complicated than it seems. if you say lets not kill him, lets torture him instead- what message is India sending out? sure that will scare the terrorists, but at what cost. we are more tolerant than militant, thats what separates us from them right.
Vishwanath Nair :
technically I'm not a part of this discussion...however being a part of a country which endorses killing a killer I feel I should say something... We had the exact same discussion in class a few months ago and my point was such... while we can argue endlessly about the fairness of a death penalty we can't deny that our country's laws dont have any ... See moreprovisions to deal with a mass murderer or say a terrorist. They're treated as any murderer is treated in the courts of our nations. We really don't have anything else to do with people like Kasab. By keeping him and the likes alive we will be wasting a lot of useful resources, money and space (considering he is an international criminal). But if we kill them, we as a society will become worse than these criminals and as Boris points out...we will be immortalizing them in the eyes of their peers.
Me :
I think he should've been put into some sort of a rehab, been educated and trained in some skill in order to better his own life. Here they're trying to execute the symptom, not by healing it, but by removing the affected part altogether. The execution of this person is more like chopping off a part of the body, due to an infection in it, that ... See morecould spread to another part of the body, when that part could very well have been treated completely.
The guy is 22. That's like, a year older than you and I am. The fact that he's been awarded capital punishment actually makes me hang my head in shame. He deserves punishment. He does. Severe punishment. But punishment should have some sort of a positive outcome. That is what punishment is for, isnt it? If its not constructive, then whats the point?
I dont believe torturing him would help either. It would just develop more and more hatred in his mind. Our aim should be to better situations, not make them worse. If a person can be made into a terrorist in 3 years, then a person can def. be made humane in 10 years, if not less.
And like you put it, the judicial system of India contradicts itself when it awards capital punishment. If he, as an individual, didnt have the right to kill other people, than we as a society have no right to kill him either. For by doing that, we are doing exactly what he did, only collectively. That makes everyone who supports this, a murderer.
Secondly, its almost famous now, that this whole thing was an inside job. Pak, in no way, would have or has benefited from that whole act. The only ones who have benefited from it, are a group of people, most probably a set of politicians, who want to instigate hatred in our minds towards that country. I'm sure people in pakistan aren't stupid enough to send their people on an undercover mission carrying all sorts of goods that have been manufactured in Pakistan (toothpaste, packs of chips, etc). It is clear that they wanted to make it obvious that these people who'd come in, were from Pak. Like Garima puts it "Just bomb/nuke the whole bloody country and terrorism will be over once and for all" 'India is too soft' " is the reaction that they wanted, and thats exactly what they got. A brilliant example of which lies in the reply by Mirande to my last status update.
A year and a half later, some very obvious things go beyond many people because of the 'hatred' and related ignorance that has been created in our minds.
Garima Bhatt :
:) wow...it really makes me optimistic to see these discussions when FB is resonating with gory war cries of "shoot him" "hang him" !! Well Vish I know keeping such criminals locked up is wasting resources, but thats the price we pay for feeling secure. All the salaries and expenses of the entire police system is also born by us only. We have been... See more paying the salaries and upkeep of the police system and yet when the terrorists attacked the VT station, videos clearly show those cops running for their lives. I think they have more to answer for wasting our resources than Kasab. Infact the question here should not be "How terrorists have the audacity to attack us" rather "HOW THE HELL DID THEY GET IN? with all the money we spend on intelligence, border security, inland security and police in the first place". One cannot blame a robber, if we left our house open, and when a house is robbed the first suspect and questioned is always the watchman, its his job to keep us safe not the robbers to have the morality not to rob us. And the fact that it would be expensive to keep him alive does not allow us to take his life just like killing the poor is not a way of eradicating poverty. Shasya I agree with your solution much more, I say give him life, keep him in solitary and make him undergo vipassana. He should think about what he did and maybe such criminals would be a perfect mouth piece to reach out and speak to others who are going down this very road and tell them the consequences of such choices and maybe save them before they fall.
or lets lynch him in public like many have suggested but like the bible sez "Let he who has never sinned cast the first stone" :)
Boris Gomes :
Violence to end violence is like f****ing for virginity.- garima bhatt..
Brilliant thot.. lol
well @ garima and shasya.. in terms of the idea of keeping him alive and giving him a new life and teching him and making him a human being, i really thought about that but at the end of the day it is also important to see that the judicial system is ... See morenot really accountable or actually responsible if when he gets out of jail he turns into a terrorist once again ? who do u blame it on ? I agree that killing him is like the worst thing to do, its acually proving that come kill as many people as u want and we will do u a favour and kill u so u can go to ur little supposed heaven that ur mad leader in some dingy corner told u that u would go to if u died on the field.
@garima- As far as people saying bomb the whole country and kill him and shit like that, it is basically the mob mentality, we are what everyone is.. its a sucky way of life but well, men they are easily fooled. As far as the whole dont let them come in, totally Agree, could not have agreed any more. I mean shasya nd i were recently having an argument about the security measures in our country and as matter of fact, no matter what happens, no matter how many terrorists come to our country and screw us, our security does not really improve anyway cause the priority basically lies in paying for the big ministers security, the swarnim for ahmd's bday or whatever, they have quoted an apporoximate of a 100 crores in the whole thing, i mean wtf ? seriously, we spend more money on everything that is concrete, but no money in possibly protecting the people of our country..
@abhik- well i agree that the picture is much bigger considering the fact that religious morals and ethics are just too influential and the irrational crowd is huge that is basically a puppet show run by some asses who actually dont give a rats bleeding ass about anything. I dont say that torture him, i said i would if it was a direct touch to my personal life, like a mirande pointed out that we cant say much cuz we are not directly affected, but even then i believe we should keep him in jail for 60 years atlest, which means that his punishment is basically a very limited life, no family, no pleasures and nothing that every human being wants.
Aman Shah :
ohk.. was waiting for a while to see other views, but thought the time is right to bring my points into this discussion. Firstly, i am merely giving counter arguments to each point boris makes in this note... this has no disregard whatsoever to any of ur comments so pls dont take this personally. You all have a right to have an opinion, and im ... See moresimply giving mine...
Ohk so here goes..
1) "this" scares any terrorist in the world by simply reinforcing the fact that such terrorists aren't going to be taken lightly.. and by lightly i mean, given long sentences and trials which keep getting postponed due to some reason or another. He might become 'patriot like' for his 'little screwed up terrorist group', but it will also make it more difficult for these groups to convert such youth.. you mentioned in point 7) that there is a lot of torture that goes into their handlers completely controlling these freaks.. one of the main reasons is India going easy on these terrorists and we've enough examples to prove this.
consider for a moment, the US. After 9/11, they went on a freakin rampage in the middle east.. Im not in any way endorsing what they did, but can you name one major terrorist strike that has happened in the US since then? there have been few, and they too have been foiled before any major damage.. come to india, what have we seen, bomb blasts, terrorist strikes in each year from atleast 2005-2010. Im not saying we 'should nuke the bloody country'... im just trying to prove what a firm "you cant mess with us" stand can do.. n this judgement is a landmark for that very reason!
2) Secondly, jehad is 'financial or physical sacrifice made for protection and promotion of Islam. and in this case, he was actually caught alive.. so if nothing else, he's prolly looked down upon bcoz they rather die than being caught by the 'enemy'.
3) This one surprises me.. If im correct, You ask how is giving death to Kasab fair to any of the... See more families of the victims..?? well, i dnt see how its not!! there are innumerous instances od victims saying how giving him a death sentence is the least they expect for what he did... again, we can't really comment coz we're not directly affected.. but id really not want to see the guy who killed my family alive even if iv become 'dead form inside"...
4) Giving him imprisonment is an expense in itself..but i guess everyones talked abt the politicians n suff.. so its not a major argument.
5) I disagree that killing one person or killing 200 is the same.. take rajiv gandhi's assasination for example. its not that it is ok to kill a few, but the sentence would obviously depend on the magnitude of the disaster... n no judiciary enjoys sentencing a convict to death... but in cases like this, its the only proper decision.
6) The judicial system does not exist to see that nobody kills nobody... the job of a judiciary is to apply and implement the laws of the country.. and the laws are indirectly framed by us... So, the judiciary is simply doing its job by sentencing him to death.!
7) Again, im assuming ur referring to the number of youth who are mindwashed to ... See morebecoming terrorists.. I believe (personally) that no one is bad at heart.. and these guys are mindwashed.. however, that cannot discount what he has done in any way.. Also, like i have mentioned, such a harsh penalty would obviously make it harder to mindwash these youth...
8) I agree that a lot of our leaders have caused a lot of deaths... and most of us know that it exists and it IS a SHAME... but that is still considerably hidden from the public eye.. Here, we're talking abt a guy who kept the whole country gripped to their tv sets for 3 days... EVERYONE saw him, and knows what he's done.. the evidence cannot be quesioned... So that is why im being extremely 'real' and i do 'actually know' what i am saying, which is why im making 'rampant arguments'..
And another important point which everyone either ignores or seems to overlook is what happened in Kandahar in Dec 1999... for those who are unaware, an Indian Airlines Flight (IC 814) carrying 176 passengers was hijacked by Pakistani nationals... In return for the hostages the govt released three arrested terrorists, the most famous being Maulana ... See moreMasood Azhar, who post his release went on to start the Jaish-e-Mohammad- the organization responsible for the Parliament attack in 2001.. Another of the released terrorists, AHmed Omar Saeed Sheikh went on to abduct and kill Daniel Pearl, the American journalist... And the third terrorist, Mushtaq Ahmed Zargar has since played an active role in training Islamic militants in POK...
Who gurantees such a thing won't happen again if Kasab is kept alive... considering the fact that he is probably revered or considered 'immortal' by his peers..??
Me :
Ah. Even though I disagree with all your points Aman, I'd like to point out that you're very well researched.
1. Boris' point made more sense. Terrorists don't care about all of that.
And about the US, its more due to increased enforced security that the attacks or attempts have reduced considerably. NOT because Bush went and invaded/destroyed ... See morenations. That served absolutely no purpose. The same way that this wont. That again was an inside job. There is enough proof to back it up as well. They werent major terror targets in the first place. The biggest attack on them, had their president as the mastermind behind it. I dont think it was too difficult for him to plant a few bombs in the towers.
2. Like I said, this too is very clearly an inside job. The whole reason Kasab was sent out there in the middle of it all was because they needed someone to be caught alive..and the way he was positioned, didnt make that too difficult a job to carry out. This case is far from usual Jehad cases. He may not be 'a legend amongst his lot' but with needing a person to be alive, Kasab did the job perfectly. A regular 20 year old guy who ran away from home is probably not their strongest liability. They could totally afford to put his life at stake.
5. If the magnitude of the crime mattered so much, then the last person to be sentenced to death in India, wouldnt have been a man who raped and killed one single girl. That sort of thing happens on an everyday basis in this country. They did it to set an example to the rest of the rapists. And i'm pretty certain the warning didnt make too much of an impact. You'll point out that the number of rapes have gone down, but then the level of the educated has also increased.
6. It is a fact that people kill and are killed on a regular basis out in the open in places like bihar/up/haryana and even metros like delhi and bombay. The judicial system doesnt work the same way with everybody. It's job is to come up with a suitable punishment. The only reason that this guy has been awarded death is because his case was a hundred times more controversial and out in the open than those other cases that I talk about(and like even you make in point #8). And also because its supposedly anti-national. That's again something that is highly questionable. It was more anti-pak if you ask me.
7. Mindwashing works both ways. Lets use that to humanities' benefit.
Those terrorists that were freed through the hijacking, they were important to the terrorist groups that they belonged to and werent meant to be caught in the first place. Kasabs case is entirely different. Like I mentioned earlier, they positioned him so strategically, its like they WANTED him to be caught. I doubt he'd be a very important asset to any of them.
Aman Shah :
Even though i may not agree with you, i'll take all ur rebutals except for teh first 2... its absurd!! Kindly correct me if im wrong, but are you trying to imply that Bush got those planes to crash into the towers?? coz if there was "enough proof" of that, iv not heard of it firstly, and secondly, the Americans wudv killed him..
secondly, im not ... See morethe most well versed abt politics and current affairs, bt id put my knowledge in the above average category amongst pl my age... n i have NOT ONCE come across this theory of the mumbai attacks being an "insider" job... I seriously dnt believe our politicians have fallen to such depths (i.e if u are trying to imply that 26/11 was the job of indian political parties)
n the reason why it is seeming anti-pak is bcoz wether u want to accept it or not, a majority of these activities are centered in pakistan... the reason being their absolute apology for a governemnt and its inability to stand against these groups who have a firm grip on the internal politics in the nation.
i have actually met and interacted with pakistani youth who are themselves ashamed of their govt as it is a widely recognized fact that there a number of terrorist groups thriving in pakistan..
Also, having close relatives involved during 1971, siachen and kargil, i can say for a fact that we face a REAL THREAT from pakistan... we can be as brotherly as we want to and as much Aman ki Asha as we want.. but there are still infiltrants getting into our borders as we debate due to our soft stance on them... Im not saying that general Pakistani masses are bad.. im simply trying to point out why it is not wrong for people to make 'everything' anti-pak..
Me :
Ok. There's this for starters. http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=530170528&ref=ts#!/album.php?aid=421831&id=530170528 .Ask for more if you want.
Google a little and you'll find enough AMERICANS who DO want to kill Bush. If you say that the proof available on the net itself isnt sufficient, then there is absolutely no way you can prove Modi ... See moreguilty either, without personal testimonials.
The point about the mumbai attacks being an inside job..well like I said earlier, the only ones who benefited from it are anti-pak communities in India. You're solid evidence of that.
They had NO other reasonable point to make. Not even Islam's power and Jehad. Earlier attacks were about that, but this one very def. wasn't. They wouldn't have made it so easy to trace their roots if it was.
8 yrs after the 9/11 bombings there is enough evidence to prove that the bombs weren't only in the planes but also in the buildings. Maybe in the near future there will be enough evidence to support what I'm saying right now too.
http://cms.ae911truth.org/
There are obviously a lot of other people who're aware of this. So what I'm saying is probably not that absurd.
And you might want to watch the movie Farenheit 9/11 if you haven't already.
Aman Shah :
i dont see how im part of an "anti pak community"... nor do i see how these anti pak communities were the only ones benefited??
i have to accept that this has taken a completely new turn.. while these links you provided do make for an interesting read, i wudnt really look too much into it... for the simple reason, that just as people in power can (supposedly) do the stuff these links claim, im pretty certain those against these people can also make up stuff.. its just an ... See moreopinion.. the links were really useful... n i never denied that bush was a stupid president.. i just questioned the premise that 9/11 was an 'insiders job', links to which u have given...
the only reason why i find it absurd is bcoz it is hard to believe that a country like America with its free press et all wouldn''t create a global issue of this, (if it is true)... coz as far as i can see, these groups activities are restricted only to the internet and some local meetings... (again, im probbably wrong, but still) thats the general point im trying to make..
Me :
I'm not saying you are. But this attack has created a suitable amount of discomfort in your head towards that nation, hasn't it? Or at least led you to generalizing and making judgments. You're still a thinker, and so I suppose wouldn't go around screaming 'Bomb Pakistan, kill fucking pakistanis!' 'We hate sania mirza because she married a ... See moreterrorist!'. But that is the impact that this attack has made on most of the general public who anyway need only a small prick to start them off about how horrid and incompetent Pakistan and its government is. That was the whole point in doing this. I have a friend researching through the matter at present. He's also come up with enough reasons as to why this is an inside job. Once he compiles it together, I shall share it with you.
And tell me, if not them, who else has benefited? How has Pakistan benefited in ANY way?
And you're calling their government an apology when we live with one of the most screwed up ones in the world.
And I KNEW you'd come up with that point, and that is why I asked you to watch the movie. The media is aware enough. :)
Aman Shah
i call their government an apology coz i do have some trust in our government... (impossible as it may sound) we are the biggest democracy in the world, so we are partially responsible, aren;t we?
n they've had a military dictator followed by leaders who're actually like puppets in the hands of these groups... such is the extent of their deep ... See morerooted existence in the country.
n this attack has not created any discomfort in my mind.. the discomfort has always been there... n it shall exist irrespective of the attacks... i can say this bcoz like i said earlier, its not simply abt this attack, just look back over the past decade.... see the number of attacks and the responsibility for most of these has been taken by groups based in paksitan.. even today, soldiers are dying on teh borders coz small groups are infiltrating into india.. just that it is not brought to media light as it is just a small group or bcoz only a "handfull died"... again, i have nothing against the people..
Garima Bhatt :
1) Really Aman do u really think any one becomes a terrorist thinking "maybe they'll take me lightly"? Do u imagine that ppl are convinced to become terrorists by saying "hey don't worry bomb them, they're going to take 20 yrs to hang u? and the guy goes... See more…"oh in that case can u give me an appointment letter?" If you heard the tapped phone conversations Their handlers had instructed them to die fighting and most of them did…so how is death a deterrent? Secondly When a guy sneakily poisons a city's water tank, or hides a bomb they're expecting/hoping not to get caught , but when a guy walks in and open fires with AK 47's in VT station and open fires at armed anti terrorist force/ cops/ millitary don't think they have the fear for their life. These guys are suicide bombers so hanging them is like convicting a suicide attempter and giving him the death penalty as a punishment for it???? WTF? :P Also I ask you when you hear the stories of our "freedom fighters" which surely were terrorists for the British raj…when you hear bhagat singh's story do u get scared? I think more and more youth came fwd to joing the freedom struggle after a Bhagat Singh not the other way around…and surely One country's terrorist is another country's freedom fighter.
2) Why do you confuse terrorist groups that are based in a country with the entire country? Pakistan suffer worse than us by the violence of these groups, bomb blasts and shoot outs by LET etc are an everyday affair there. Just like us, they believe that RAW is supporting these groups to create carnage in their country, can you swallow that? You pointed out the example of Iraq and Bush…do I need to remind you that after they dug up and bombed the entire country with its innocent and already troubled population they a) did not find any WMD's b) found no connection b/w Osama and Saddam and most importantly while thousand of Iraqui kids/ women/ men are roasted and dead…Osama still is alive and kicking in some place on the earth. What do you do when you get a rat infestation in your house? Blow up/ burn down your entire house?
3) How can you for a moment thing that a 20 yr old Mercenary like kasab is the same as Maulana Masoor? They don't give a fuck about Kasab, and they have already washed their hands off him saying he is not one of theirs. Kasab is a pawn, and that is my point exactly, there is nothing to rejoice if you hang the petty criminal who took the "supari" to... See more kill you, while the guys who gave the "supari" are still out there…they will find another one like him.
4) And one point that really intrigues me is that how is a "guilty" sentence for Kasab who made no attempt to hide or resist arrest, who had no plan for returning back to Pak so good when the Indians who helped these guys with maps and information were let free??? Those were the guys who hoped to avoid arrest and they did. Why is no one talking about that? Who is worse a paki boy who is made to believe India is the cause of all their problems and comes to kill and die or the Indians who help these guys to come bomb their own country?
and Aman there is more that enough proof out there that 911 was an inside job. We live in a capitalist world and if you study economics with world politics, you will come to one single conclusion: ITS all about profit, a simple technique to find the murderer of a guy is to think "who benefits the most" and in more cases than not IT IS THE GUY WHO ... See moreBENEFITS the most that DID IT. So think who benefited after 911- Iraq or USA? who benefited most after the Ghodra incident and the following riots? modi or the muslims? and why would Hansie Cronje fix matches and lose? coz the money they make by losing is much more than they do by winning? Why do educated and smart Indians migrate to USA and not stay and serve their "Bharat Mata"? wake up and admit it Aman, In today's world everyone is driven by economic/ power gains and religion/ patriotism is just an eyewash to distract the public
Mirande Rajeev Shah :
well i do quite agree to wht aman is saying in this whole debate.... sending him in a rehab (as shasya said) is no solution to it ...
i mean whts the guarantee tht tomo when he's outta it as a good man, he's not gonna get influenced once again an do the same....
as far as giving him life imprisonment (as boris said) an torturing him to mad levels ... See moretill he feels like dying, is'nt tht worse than killing him once an for all.... where r our morals an ethics of not killing someone when we r killing him a hundred times everyday by torturing him an forcing him to die?
and even if we do tht who is going to come to know in the outside world .... 5 -10 years down the line ppl r going to forget tht there's some kasab lying in the jail for so an so reason...
an we r the ppl who travel in cars an live lavishly....think abt those who travel everyday through buses an trains... everyday they live with the fear tht they r gonna be killed sooner or later cause of these terrorist attacks...
its not abt proving it to any terrorist group or giving an answer to any1.... its abt maintaining the law an order of our country....
though our country's security system has loop holes but because of tht if ppl believe tht they can come in an kill our ppl over an over again then im sorry but i would'nt support tht in anyway....bombay... ahmedabad... jaipur... i mean how much r we going to tolerate..
we r not going in their territory an killing them recklessly...as garima puts it(bombing the entire country) but if they take the liberty to create such a massacre in our country then at some point a stern step is to be taken.
Garima Bhatt :
My question to aman and mirandehere is just this "WHO ARE THEY"?
And i am expecting 1 word answers, for such objective solutions there must be objective targets. So please tell me who are the "THEY" you guys keep referring to...coz I prefer the word "we" here.
If we want the right answers...we must ask the right questions.
oh ya...it just struck me...that terrorists are formed coz they feel ppl are taking them lightly and they want u to sit up and take notice. So THEY want you to NOT take them lightly...that wud mean the only way to defeat THEM wud be to TAKE THEM LIGHTLY ;) instead of saying lets "not take them lightly" thats wat they want in the first place right? :D
Boris :
1. Man seriously, get a grip, how on earth does this scare any terrorist anywhere in the world, i mean come on, there are more suicide bombers produced everyday and it will go on forever, this way the guy is gna be all patriot like in his little screwed up terrorist group.
2. Killing kasab is like doing him the biggest favour ever, well if a lot of url dont know, to die is one of the things that makes these jackasses immortal fr their peers, i mean getting killed after killing 166 people, he is now legend, so basically we, our judicial system is contributing and actually encouraging this even more
3. I believe that the people who died had some family, for those families life is hell now cuz they live forever with the loss of their loved one and the punishment to dis guy is actually not a punishment, infact it is such a breeze, no suffering and just die.. The affected people are going to go through way more emotional and psychological trauma and some will live dead inside.. how is that fair to any of those people
4. I agree that a lot of money was spent on keeping him alive, why do that, give him like a 60 years of imprisonment and give him the worst life ever, let him regret what he did every second of his life.
5. The very idea of killing one person or killing 200 people, it is still killing someone else, then why does he get death sentence and a guy with 2 murders proven get 20 years of trauma, why no give him capital punishment and let him go.
6. the fact that the judicial system exists is to see to it that nobody kills nobody and that no human being has the power and right to take the life of another human being then how does it give the judicial system the right to kill a person, who kills the judicial system?
7. I am not saying that kasab is a good guy, in fact I would torture him to extents he would cry tears of blood, but there is a lot we don’t know abt these people and how they actually become what they are, there is a huge amount of torture and repeated black mail and religious black mail that goes on that make certain people completely control these freaks, so I really don’t think killing them is fair, but they should be punished, if he decides to kill himself that is his decision not our decision.
8. considering the fact that there are a lot of our leaders, I will not name, who have caused the death of a lot more people, where are they ? in their beautiful houses and the fast cars and chartered helicopters I guess, lets get real and actually know before we make rampant arguments.
Garima :
To add more to the discussion, I just remember how many of the people pretending to be shocked and outraged by the actions of kasab and co on 26/11 have often given a very "simplistic" solution to the Indo-Pak problem. "Just bomb/nuke the whole bloody country and terrorism will be over once and for all" "India is too soft" they say. How is ... See ... See moremorebombing/nuking an entire country full of innocent, uninvolved people for the crimes of a few thousand "terrorists" any less sinister in its intention than what the terrorists are doing in India. Since they believe India is the cause of their problems, just like we think pak is of ours, it is ridiculous to be assuming a higher moral ground. Violence to end violence is like f****ing for virginity.
"the mood and temper of the public in regard to the treatment of crime and criminals is one of the most unfailing tests of the civilization of any country. a calm and dispassionate recognition of the rights... See more….even of the convicted criminal against the state,... [and] tireless [efforts] towards the discovery of curative and regenerative processes,… mark and measure the stored up strength of a nation, and are the sign and proof of the living virtue in it" - winston churchill
Abhik Basu :
while i completely agree with the point that killing them helps them achieve the very immortality they wish to seek, i feel like the judiciary has its hands tied. we are having this argument after he has been given capital punishment, but think for a moment if he wasnt. there would be a HUGE uproar in the ranks for its the rational beings in this ... See morecountry that are the real minority.
my views on capital punishment are different altogether, but i feel like no one feel better or worse if and when he is executed. an execution is a mere treatment of the symptom, not the cause.
the truth is this argument is more complicated than it seems. if you say lets not kill him, lets torture him instead- what message is India sending out? sure that will scare the terrorists, but at what cost. we are more tolerant than militant, thats what separates us from them right.
Vishwanath Nair :
technically I'm not a part of this discussion...however being a part of a country which endorses killing a killer I feel I should say something... We had the exact same discussion in class a few months ago and my point was such... while we can argue endlessly about the fairness of a death penalty we can't deny that our country's laws dont have any ... See moreprovisions to deal with a mass murderer or say a terrorist. They're treated as any murderer is treated in the courts of our nations. We really don't have anything else to do with people like Kasab. By keeping him and the likes alive we will be wasting a lot of useful resources, money and space (considering he is an international criminal). But if we kill them, we as a society will become worse than these criminals and as Boris points out...we will be immortalizing them in the eyes of their peers.
Me :
I think he should've been put into some sort of a rehab, been educated and trained in some skill in order to better his own life. Here they're trying to execute the symptom, not by healing it, but by removing the affected part altogether. The execution of this person is more like chopping off a part of the body, due to an infection in it, that ... See morecould spread to another part of the body, when that part could very well have been treated completely.
The guy is 22. That's like, a year older than you and I am. The fact that he's been awarded capital punishment actually makes me hang my head in shame. He deserves punishment. He does. Severe punishment. But punishment should have some sort of a positive outcome. That is what punishment is for, isnt it? If its not constructive, then whats the point?
I dont believe torturing him would help either. It would just develop more and more hatred in his mind. Our aim should be to better situations, not make them worse. If a person can be made into a terrorist in 3 years, then a person can def. be made humane in 10 years, if not less.
And like you put it, the judicial system of India contradicts itself when it awards capital punishment. If he, as an individual, didnt have the right to kill other people, than we as a society have no right to kill him either. For by doing that, we are doing exactly what he did, only collectively. That makes everyone who supports this, a murderer.
Secondly, its almost famous now, that this whole thing was an inside job. Pak, in no way, would have or has benefited from that whole act. The only ones who have benefited from it, are a group of people, most probably a set of politicians, who want to instigate hatred in our minds towards that country. I'm sure people in pakistan aren't stupid enough to send their people on an undercover mission carrying all sorts of goods that have been manufactured in Pakistan (toothpaste, packs of chips, etc). It is clear that they wanted to make it obvious that these people who'd come in, were from Pak. Like Garima puts it "Just bomb/nuke the whole bloody country and terrorism will be over once and for all" 'India is too soft' " is the reaction that they wanted, and thats exactly what they got. A brilliant example of which lies in the reply by Mirande to my last status update.
A year and a half later, some very obvious things go beyond many people because of the 'hatred' and related ignorance that has been created in our minds.
Garima Bhatt :
:) wow...it really makes me optimistic to see these discussions when FB is resonating with gory war cries of "shoot him" "hang him" !! Well Vish I know keeping such criminals locked up is wasting resources, but thats the price we pay for feeling secure. All the salaries and expenses of the entire police system is also born by us only. We have been... See more paying the salaries and upkeep of the police system and yet when the terrorists attacked the VT station, videos clearly show those cops running for their lives. I think they have more to answer for wasting our resources than Kasab. Infact the question here should not be "How terrorists have the audacity to attack us" rather "HOW THE HELL DID THEY GET IN? with all the money we spend on intelligence, border security, inland security and police in the first place". One cannot blame a robber, if we left our house open, and when a house is robbed the first suspect and questioned is always the watchman, its his job to keep us safe not the robbers to have the morality not to rob us. And the fact that it would be expensive to keep him alive does not allow us to take his life just like killing the poor is not a way of eradicating poverty. Shasya I agree with your solution much more, I say give him life, keep him in solitary and make him undergo vipassana. He should think about what he did and maybe such criminals would be a perfect mouth piece to reach out and speak to others who are going down this very road and tell them the consequences of such choices and maybe save them before they fall.
or lets lynch him in public like many have suggested but like the bible sez "Let he who has never sinned cast the first stone" :)
Boris Gomes :
Violence to end violence is like f****ing for virginity.- garima bhatt..
Brilliant thot.. lol
well @ garima and shasya.. in terms of the idea of keeping him alive and giving him a new life and teching him and making him a human being, i really thought about that but at the end of the day it is also important to see that the judicial system is ... See morenot really accountable or actually responsible if when he gets out of jail he turns into a terrorist once again ? who do u blame it on ? I agree that killing him is like the worst thing to do, its acually proving that come kill as many people as u want and we will do u a favour and kill u so u can go to ur little supposed heaven that ur mad leader in some dingy corner told u that u would go to if u died on the field.
@garima- As far as people saying bomb the whole country and kill him and shit like that, it is basically the mob mentality, we are what everyone is.. its a sucky way of life but well, men they are easily fooled. As far as the whole dont let them come in, totally Agree, could not have agreed any more. I mean shasya nd i were recently having an argument about the security measures in our country and as matter of fact, no matter what happens, no matter how many terrorists come to our country and screw us, our security does not really improve anyway cause the priority basically lies in paying for the big ministers security, the swarnim for ahmd's bday or whatever, they have quoted an apporoximate of a 100 crores in the whole thing, i mean wtf ? seriously, we spend more money on everything that is concrete, but no money in possibly protecting the people of our country..
@abhik- well i agree that the picture is much bigger considering the fact that religious morals and ethics are just too influential and the irrational crowd is huge that is basically a puppet show run by some asses who actually dont give a rats bleeding ass about anything. I dont say that torture him, i said i would if it was a direct touch to my personal life, like a mirande pointed out that we cant say much cuz we are not directly affected, but even then i believe we should keep him in jail for 60 years atlest, which means that his punishment is basically a very limited life, no family, no pleasures and nothing that every human being wants.
Aman Shah :
ohk.. was waiting for a while to see other views, but thought the time is right to bring my points into this discussion. Firstly, i am merely giving counter arguments to each point boris makes in this note... this has no disregard whatsoever to any of ur comments so pls dont take this personally. You all have a right to have an opinion, and im ... See moresimply giving mine...
Ohk so here goes..
1) "this" scares any terrorist in the world by simply reinforcing the fact that such terrorists aren't going to be taken lightly.. and by lightly i mean, given long sentences and trials which keep getting postponed due to some reason or another. He might become 'patriot like' for his 'little screwed up terrorist group', but it will also make it more difficult for these groups to convert such youth.. you mentioned in point 7) that there is a lot of torture that goes into their handlers completely controlling these freaks.. one of the main reasons is India going easy on these terrorists and we've enough examples to prove this.
consider for a moment, the US. After 9/11, they went on a freakin rampage in the middle east.. Im not in any way endorsing what they did, but can you name one major terrorist strike that has happened in the US since then? there have been few, and they too have been foiled before any major damage.. come to india, what have we seen, bomb blasts, terrorist strikes in each year from atleast 2005-2010. Im not saying we 'should nuke the bloody country'... im just trying to prove what a firm "you cant mess with us" stand can do.. n this judgement is a landmark for that very reason!
2) Secondly, jehad is 'financial or physical sacrifice made for protection and promotion of Islam. and in this case, he was actually caught alive.. so if nothing else, he's prolly looked down upon bcoz they rather die than being caught by the 'enemy'.
3) This one surprises me.. If im correct, You ask how is giving death to Kasab fair to any of the... See more families of the victims..?? well, i dnt see how its not!! there are innumerous instances od victims saying how giving him a death sentence is the least they expect for what he did... again, we can't really comment coz we're not directly affected.. but id really not want to see the guy who killed my family alive even if iv become 'dead form inside"...
4) Giving him imprisonment is an expense in itself..but i guess everyones talked abt the politicians n suff.. so its not a major argument.
5) I disagree that killing one person or killing 200 is the same.. take rajiv gandhi's assasination for example. its not that it is ok to kill a few, but the sentence would obviously depend on the magnitude of the disaster... n no judiciary enjoys sentencing a convict to death... but in cases like this, its the only proper decision.
6) The judicial system does not exist to see that nobody kills nobody... the job of a judiciary is to apply and implement the laws of the country.. and the laws are indirectly framed by us... So, the judiciary is simply doing its job by sentencing him to death.!
7) Again, im assuming ur referring to the number of youth who are mindwashed to ... See morebecoming terrorists.. I believe (personally) that no one is bad at heart.. and these guys are mindwashed.. however, that cannot discount what he has done in any way.. Also, like i have mentioned, such a harsh penalty would obviously make it harder to mindwash these youth...
8) I agree that a lot of our leaders have caused a lot of deaths... and most of us know that it exists and it IS a SHAME... but that is still considerably hidden from the public eye.. Here, we're talking abt a guy who kept the whole country gripped to their tv sets for 3 days... EVERYONE saw him, and knows what he's done.. the evidence cannot be quesioned... So that is why im being extremely 'real' and i do 'actually know' what i am saying, which is why im making 'rampant arguments'..
And another important point which everyone either ignores or seems to overlook is what happened in Kandahar in Dec 1999... for those who are unaware, an Indian Airlines Flight (IC 814) carrying 176 passengers was hijacked by Pakistani nationals... In return for the hostages the govt released three arrested terrorists, the most famous being Maulana ... See moreMasood Azhar, who post his release went on to start the Jaish-e-Mohammad- the organization responsible for the Parliament attack in 2001.. Another of the released terrorists, AHmed Omar Saeed Sheikh went on to abduct and kill Daniel Pearl, the American journalist... And the third terrorist, Mushtaq Ahmed Zargar has since played an active role in training Islamic militants in POK...
Who gurantees such a thing won't happen again if Kasab is kept alive... considering the fact that he is probably revered or considered 'immortal' by his peers..??
Me :
Ah. Even though I disagree with all your points Aman, I'd like to point out that you're very well researched.
1. Boris' point made more sense. Terrorists don't care about all of that.
And about the US, its more due to increased enforced security that the attacks or attempts have reduced considerably. NOT because Bush went and invaded/destroyed ... See morenations. That served absolutely no purpose. The same way that this wont. That again was an inside job. There is enough proof to back it up as well. They werent major terror targets in the first place. The biggest attack on them, had their president as the mastermind behind it. I dont think it was too difficult for him to plant a few bombs in the towers.
2. Like I said, this too is very clearly an inside job. The whole reason Kasab was sent out there in the middle of it all was because they needed someone to be caught alive..and the way he was positioned, didnt make that too difficult a job to carry out. This case is far from usual Jehad cases. He may not be 'a legend amongst his lot' but with needing a person to be alive, Kasab did the job perfectly. A regular 20 year old guy who ran away from home is probably not their strongest liability. They could totally afford to put his life at stake.
5. If the magnitude of the crime mattered so much, then the last person to be sentenced to death in India, wouldnt have been a man who raped and killed one single girl. That sort of thing happens on an everyday basis in this country. They did it to set an example to the rest of the rapists. And i'm pretty certain the warning didnt make too much of an impact. You'll point out that the number of rapes have gone down, but then the level of the educated has also increased.
6. It is a fact that people kill and are killed on a regular basis out in the open in places like bihar/up/haryana and even metros like delhi and bombay. The judicial system doesnt work the same way with everybody. It's job is to come up with a suitable punishment. The only reason that this guy has been awarded death is because his case was a hundred times more controversial and out in the open than those other cases that I talk about(and like even you make in point #8). And also because its supposedly anti-national. That's again something that is highly questionable. It was more anti-pak if you ask me.
7. Mindwashing works both ways. Lets use that to humanities' benefit.
Those terrorists that were freed through the hijacking, they were important to the terrorist groups that they belonged to and werent meant to be caught in the first place. Kasabs case is entirely different. Like I mentioned earlier, they positioned him so strategically, its like they WANTED him to be caught. I doubt he'd be a very important asset to any of them.
Aman Shah :
Even though i may not agree with you, i'll take all ur rebutals except for teh first 2... its absurd!! Kindly correct me if im wrong, but are you trying to imply that Bush got those planes to crash into the towers?? coz if there was "enough proof" of that, iv not heard of it firstly, and secondly, the Americans wudv killed him..
secondly, im not ... See morethe most well versed abt politics and current affairs, bt id put my knowledge in the above average category amongst pl my age... n i have NOT ONCE come across this theory of the mumbai attacks being an "insider" job... I seriously dnt believe our politicians have fallen to such depths (i.e if u are trying to imply that 26/11 was the job of indian political parties)
n the reason why it is seeming anti-pak is bcoz wether u want to accept it or not, a majority of these activities are centered in pakistan... the reason being their absolute apology for a governemnt and its inability to stand against these groups who have a firm grip on the internal politics in the nation.
i have actually met and interacted with pakistani youth who are themselves ashamed of their govt as it is a widely recognized fact that there a number of terrorist groups thriving in pakistan..
Also, having close relatives involved during 1971, siachen and kargil, i can say for a fact that we face a REAL THREAT from pakistan... we can be as brotherly as we want to and as much Aman ki Asha as we want.. but there are still infiltrants getting into our borders as we debate due to our soft stance on them... Im not saying that general Pakistani masses are bad.. im simply trying to point out why it is not wrong for people to make 'everything' anti-pak..
Me :
Ok. There's this for starters. http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=530170528&ref=ts#!/album.php?aid=421831&id=530170528 .Ask for more if you want.
Google a little and you'll find enough AMERICANS who DO want to kill Bush. If you say that the proof available on the net itself isnt sufficient, then there is absolutely no way you can prove Modi ... See moreguilty either, without personal testimonials.
The point about the mumbai attacks being an inside job..well like I said earlier, the only ones who benefited from it are anti-pak communities in India. You're solid evidence of that.
They had NO other reasonable point to make. Not even Islam's power and Jehad. Earlier attacks were about that, but this one very def. wasn't. They wouldn't have made it so easy to trace their roots if it was.
8 yrs after the 9/11 bombings there is enough evidence to prove that the bombs weren't only in the planes but also in the buildings. Maybe in the near future there will be enough evidence to support what I'm saying right now too.
http://cms.ae911truth.org/
There are obviously a lot of other people who're aware of this. So what I'm saying is probably not that absurd.
And you might want to watch the movie Farenheit 9/11 if you haven't already.
Aman Shah :
i dont see how im part of an "anti pak community"... nor do i see how these anti pak communities were the only ones benefited??
i have to accept that this has taken a completely new turn.. while these links you provided do make for an interesting read, i wudnt really look too much into it... for the simple reason, that just as people in power can (supposedly) do the stuff these links claim, im pretty certain those against these people can also make up stuff.. its just an ... See moreopinion.. the links were really useful... n i never denied that bush was a stupid president.. i just questioned the premise that 9/11 was an 'insiders job', links to which u have given...
the only reason why i find it absurd is bcoz it is hard to believe that a country like America with its free press et all wouldn''t create a global issue of this, (if it is true)... coz as far as i can see, these groups activities are restricted only to the internet and some local meetings... (again, im probbably wrong, but still) thats the general point im trying to make..
Me :
I'm not saying you are. But this attack has created a suitable amount of discomfort in your head towards that nation, hasn't it? Or at least led you to generalizing and making judgments. You're still a thinker, and so I suppose wouldn't go around screaming 'Bomb Pakistan, kill fucking pakistanis!' 'We hate sania mirza because she married a ... See moreterrorist!'. But that is the impact that this attack has made on most of the general public who anyway need only a small prick to start them off about how horrid and incompetent Pakistan and its government is. That was the whole point in doing this. I have a friend researching through the matter at present. He's also come up with enough reasons as to why this is an inside job. Once he compiles it together, I shall share it with you.
And tell me, if not them, who else has benefited? How has Pakistan benefited in ANY way?
And you're calling their government an apology when we live with one of the most screwed up ones in the world.
And I KNEW you'd come up with that point, and that is why I asked you to watch the movie. The media is aware enough. :)
Aman Shah
i call their government an apology coz i do have some trust in our government... (impossible as it may sound) we are the biggest democracy in the world, so we are partially responsible, aren;t we?
n they've had a military dictator followed by leaders who're actually like puppets in the hands of these groups... such is the extent of their deep ... See morerooted existence in the country.
n this attack has not created any discomfort in my mind.. the discomfort has always been there... n it shall exist irrespective of the attacks... i can say this bcoz like i said earlier, its not simply abt this attack, just look back over the past decade.... see the number of attacks and the responsibility for most of these has been taken by groups based in paksitan.. even today, soldiers are dying on teh borders coz small groups are infiltrating into india.. just that it is not brought to media light as it is just a small group or bcoz only a "handfull died"... again, i have nothing against the people..
Garima Bhatt :
1) Really Aman do u really think any one becomes a terrorist thinking "maybe they'll take me lightly"? Do u imagine that ppl are convinced to become terrorists by saying "hey don't worry bomb them, they're going to take 20 yrs to hang u? and the guy goes... See more…"oh in that case can u give me an appointment letter?" If you heard the tapped phone conversations Their handlers had instructed them to die fighting and most of them did…so how is death a deterrent? Secondly When a guy sneakily poisons a city's water tank, or hides a bomb they're expecting/hoping not to get caught , but when a guy walks in and open fires with AK 47's in VT station and open fires at armed anti terrorist force/ cops/ millitary don't think they have the fear for their life. These guys are suicide bombers so hanging them is like convicting a suicide attempter and giving him the death penalty as a punishment for it???? WTF? :P Also I ask you when you hear the stories of our "freedom fighters" which surely were terrorists for the British raj…when you hear bhagat singh's story do u get scared? I think more and more youth came fwd to joing the freedom struggle after a Bhagat Singh not the other way around…and surely One country's terrorist is another country's freedom fighter.
2) Why do you confuse terrorist groups that are based in a country with the entire country? Pakistan suffer worse than us by the violence of these groups, bomb blasts and shoot outs by LET etc are an everyday affair there. Just like us, they believe that RAW is supporting these groups to create carnage in their country, can you swallow that? You pointed out the example of Iraq and Bush…do I need to remind you that after they dug up and bombed the entire country with its innocent and already troubled population they a) did not find any WMD's b) found no connection b/w Osama and Saddam and most importantly while thousand of Iraqui kids/ women/ men are roasted and dead…Osama still is alive and kicking in some place on the earth. What do you do when you get a rat infestation in your house? Blow up/ burn down your entire house?
3) How can you for a moment thing that a 20 yr old Mercenary like kasab is the same as Maulana Masoor? They don't give a fuck about Kasab, and they have already washed their hands off him saying he is not one of theirs. Kasab is a pawn, and that is my point exactly, there is nothing to rejoice if you hang the petty criminal who took the "supari" to... See more kill you, while the guys who gave the "supari" are still out there…they will find another one like him.
4) And one point that really intrigues me is that how is a "guilty" sentence for Kasab who made no attempt to hide or resist arrest, who had no plan for returning back to Pak so good when the Indians who helped these guys with maps and information were let free??? Those were the guys who hoped to avoid arrest and they did. Why is no one talking about that? Who is worse a paki boy who is made to believe India is the cause of all their problems and comes to kill and die or the Indians who help these guys to come bomb their own country?
and Aman there is more that enough proof out there that 911 was an inside job. We live in a capitalist world and if you study economics with world politics, you will come to one single conclusion: ITS all about profit, a simple technique to find the murderer of a guy is to think "who benefits the most" and in more cases than not IT IS THE GUY WHO ... See moreBENEFITS the most that DID IT. So think who benefited after 911- Iraq or USA? who benefited most after the Ghodra incident and the following riots? modi or the muslims? and why would Hansie Cronje fix matches and lose? coz the money they make by losing is much more than they do by winning? Why do educated and smart Indians migrate to USA and not stay and serve their "Bharat Mata"? wake up and admit it Aman, In today's world everyone is driven by economic/ power gains and religion/ patriotism is just an eyewash to distract the public
Mirande Rajeev Shah :
well i do quite agree to wht aman is saying in this whole debate.... sending him in a rehab (as shasya said) is no solution to it ...
i mean whts the guarantee tht tomo when he's outta it as a good man, he's not gonna get influenced once again an do the same....
as far as giving him life imprisonment (as boris said) an torturing him to mad levels ... See moretill he feels like dying, is'nt tht worse than killing him once an for all.... where r our morals an ethics of not killing someone when we r killing him a hundred times everyday by torturing him an forcing him to die?
and even if we do tht who is going to come to know in the outside world .... 5 -10 years down the line ppl r going to forget tht there's some kasab lying in the jail for so an so reason...
an we r the ppl who travel in cars an live lavishly....think abt those who travel everyday through buses an trains... everyday they live with the fear tht they r gonna be killed sooner or later cause of these terrorist attacks...
its not abt proving it to any terrorist group or giving an answer to any1.... its abt maintaining the law an order of our country....
though our country's security system has loop holes but because of tht if ppl believe tht they can come in an kill our ppl over an over again then im sorry but i would'nt support tht in anyway....bombay... ahmedabad... jaipur... i mean how much r we going to tolerate..
we r not going in their territory an killing them recklessly...as garima puts it(bombing the entire country) but if they take the liberty to create such a massacre in our country then at some point a stern step is to be taken.
Garima Bhatt :
My question to aman and mirandehere is just this "WHO ARE THEY"?
And i am expecting 1 word answers, for such objective solutions there must be objective targets. So please tell me who are the "THEY" you guys keep referring to...coz I prefer the word "we" here.
If we want the right answers...we must ask the right questions.
oh ya...it just struck me...that terrorists are formed coz they feel ppl are taking them lightly and they want u to sit up and take notice. So THEY want you to NOT take them lightly...that wud mean the only way to defeat THEM wud be to TAKE THEM LIGHTLY ;) instead of saying lets "not take them lightly" thats wat they want in the first place right? :D
Saturday, April 3, 2010
The sun's rays beat down, harsher
As glowing light, blindingly bright
And yet not one thing is clearer
Not one thing seems right
Magnitude doesn’t define competence
Bright light doesn’t always reveal
Hidden secrets, that make little sense
Facts that lack appeal
Theres so much that we don’t see
And there’s so much that isn’t known
But being ignorant lets us be free
And so, our mind is a clone
If you stop seeking and start believing
Everything that everybody says
Then you cant see what the sun's exposing
Because you're wearing sunglasses
Haha. Juvenile.
As glowing light, blindingly bright
And yet not one thing is clearer
Not one thing seems right
Magnitude doesn’t define competence
Bright light doesn’t always reveal
Hidden secrets, that make little sense
Facts that lack appeal
Theres so much that we don’t see
And there’s so much that isn’t known
But being ignorant lets us be free
And so, our mind is a clone
If you stop seeking and start believing
Everything that everybody says
Then you cant see what the sun's exposing
Because you're wearing sunglasses
Haha. Juvenile.
Tuesday, October 13, 2009
"Ye Duniya Agar Mil Bhi Jaaye Toh Kya Hai?"
This society of emotionally drought stricken decaying souls..dressed in the choicest on the outside, with tattered morale’s, barely able to cover up, inside.. What will you achieve even if u achieve a place in this world?
This world of buildings, apathy and materialism. This highly deceptive inhumane world where everything’s a façade.. The materialistic pleasure derived from pathetic worldly things. The money, the power, the pretense. What is all of it worth? What happens after you achieve it all? This world of vanity. Plastic exteriors. Rotting interiors. Achieve it. Gain it all. Become a part of the farce. You’re the crowned elite.
What then? Happiness? Satisfaction?
Doubtful.
This world of buildings, apathy and materialism. This highly deceptive inhumane world where everything’s a façade.. The materialistic pleasure derived from pathetic worldly things. The money, the power, the pretense. What is all of it worth? What happens after you achieve it all? This world of vanity. Plastic exteriors. Rotting interiors. Achieve it. Gain it all. Become a part of the farce. You’re the crowned elite.
What then? Happiness? Satisfaction?
Doubtful.
Wednesday, April 8, 2009
Wednesday, March 18, 2009
Humanity’s a dying realization of an ending evolution
To define the acceptable from the erroneous
Where ethics play their moralistic trumpets
To a world deafened by malice and spite
Where is that world that we’d be happy to achieve
The world of beautiful bliss and far-fetched fairytales
This world is as worthless as those fried chips
That we savor initially, but that fill not our stomach
But add to the pot belly that surrounds it
It’s all excessive fat, really. Unhealthy and pointless
But people still crave for it, like it’s all that matters.
When all that truly matters, is imperially ignored
And the power of accomplishment, misused
Only to lead one world to another, of more apathetic souls
To define the acceptable from the erroneous
Where ethics play their moralistic trumpets
To a world deafened by malice and spite
Where is that world that we’d be happy to achieve
The world of beautiful bliss and far-fetched fairytales
This world is as worthless as those fried chips
That we savor initially, but that fill not our stomach
But add to the pot belly that surrounds it
It’s all excessive fat, really. Unhealthy and pointless
But people still crave for it, like it’s all that matters.
When all that truly matters, is imperially ignored
And the power of accomplishment, misused
Only to lead one world to another, of more apathetic souls
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